Friday, December 3, 2010

David Silverman vs. Fox News Panel


December 3, 2010 on Fox News

46 comments:

  1. Since when does 5 people ganging up on 1 dude constitute a debate?

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  2. For those idiots who have never seen an offensive atheist billboard.

    http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_j9oDqG2zBGE/SSBmDUWcsEI/AAAAAAAACYA/RGi2-q0RZRo/s400/christian+billboard+one.jpg

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  3. They thought 5:1 would be the correct ratio to drown out the voice of reason.  Obviously their calculation was incorrect.

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  4. I'm holdin' out for an upcomming Fox debate: "The Athiest Kid next door vs. Liberty University Faculty & Student Body."

    Bill-o, university mascot, will host the debate while mounted on a saddled dinosaur.

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  5. If yer a heathen atheist in Monongah, WV, ya keeps yer head down and do'n break de skyline.

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  6. <span>I'm holdin' out for an upcoming Fox debate: "The Athiest Kid next door vs. Liberty University Faculty & Student Body."  
     
    Bill-o, university mascot, will host the debate while mounted on a saddled dinosaur.</span>

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  7. This shows their dishonesty, if they follow public religiou discourse, then they know these dign exist.

    The fact that they deny knowledge of them speaks volumes about their honesty - and lack there of.

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  8. Silverman irritates the hell out of me.

    He often comes across as someone who knows his material, and then assumes others know it also, and so instead of explaining an argument merely presents it assuming everyone shares his background informarion.

    When he says 'beliving in Jesus is no different to beliving in Zeus,' we as atheists know that he means there is no evidence for either belief and both are myths. However, those on the panel do not, they just think, "How can you say I can believe in Zeus just as easily as believe in Jesus.!?!?"

    For the theist he is speaking gibberish - all because he assumes too much information on the part of the people he presents his case to. Spell it out Silveman.

    There is no more evidence for Jesus then there is for Zeus. Stop saying beliving in one is the same as beliving in the other - and then not explain why that is.

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  9. Wow, I feel like Dave completely wiped the floor with them. He countered and destroyed every single one of their "points." If you look at the end of the video, the pro-christian gentleman in the middle looks like he's getting incredibly frustrated that he can't counter any of Dave's arguments.

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  10. Why don't you athiests attack Muslim faith or RAMADAN. In fact why don't you go too Saudi and do it. That'll show your convitions

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  11. Fake Hillsong ChurchDecember 3, 2010 at 9:47 PM

    In America it's logical to go after the big fish spreading ignorance and stupidity. But all the same athiests do "attack" the Muslim faith. Just look at Christopher Hitchens or Bill Maher. 

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  12. Yeah, he should be reminded that when talking to adults about their childish beliefs, he should talk to them like talking to children.

    The biggest miss for me was at 9:54, when in reply he says 'mythology' and confuses the issue further, instead of saying "what you call "those elements", are gods" and cut straight to the point.

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  13. Bill, I am an atheist and an apostate from Islam. I attack Muslims only like ..... ALL THE TIME!

    We all address our immediate circumstance and that which we know best. It's natural. Our convictions would be suspect if we DEFENDED another religion but are most definitely not that if choose to address what is more immediate and real to us.

    And, by the way, what you just did is a TYPICAL Muslim response to perceived threats: denial and deflection. You have the makings of a VERY good Muslim, Sir.

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  14. I agree.  This was the best I've seen him.  In other times in front of the camera he's been weak, but this one was pretty clean.

    The lady who was saying she wouldn't be offended by a billboard that said "We atheists don't believe in God" should look over some of the feedback of the "Millions of Americans are Good without God" campaign.  Maybe she wouldn't be, but lots of Americans are offended by ANY hint that ANYONE doesn't believe in god.

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  15. Hey guys let's not be too mean here.  Don't forget that Christians are a tiny minority in America and we shouldn't criticize them and make them feel hurt and offended.  It's not their fault that they are victims in all of this.  It's sad to see the powerful atheist majority attack the defenseless like this.

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  16. To defend Silverman he's relatively new at this and it's hard to make all of your points in a tiny TV segment with 4 hungry vultures just waiting for you to slightly pause so they can interrupt and mess up flow.  TV debates on these shows should really stop.  I think they add far more confusion than anything.

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  17. Unfair ganging up on the guy, and yet David still held his ground and made good points.

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  18. He did better this time, but still would do well to go over the defenses a bit.  Esp. with the fact that the xtian debate points barely change from one to the next.  Come up with a 12 second response to the always popular arguments like "but atheism is a religion too" and wack those lob balls out of the park!  

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  19. I'm getting tired of seeing this crap repeat itself... When is Fox News going to quit this stupid shit? Are they expecting Silverman to eventually crack? Idiots.

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  20. This was a very reasonable "debate" by Faux News standards. I was impressed it didn't divulge into name calling. The best part in my opinion was when that aweful woman could not even concede that signs saying that atheists are going to hell and atheists are unpatriotic was offensive. 

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  21. I don't think he is actually all that bad. I mean, yes, he is nowhere near the intellectual giant of Hitchens or Harris. And he duffs up some of his points which seem quite obvious to an audience like us. But he comes across quite personable and I think that is invaluable when an atheist appears on a channel like Fox News. More often than not they use the same bull-baiting techniques as Scientologists to devalue what the other person is saying and elicit an aggressive response. The way that Silverman handled this, and the Megyn Kelly interview, was quite effective in my opinion. 

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  22. What I found disappointing was Silverman not challenging the guy next to him regarding the evidence of Jesus' existence.  There is none, and he let this guy off without a peep.

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  23. She says, "Your faith is based on... your belief that there is no god is a belief about god."

    I've heard this argument too many times, with nobody calling it out.  The statement about not believing in god assumes the atheist agrees with the concept.  Atheists do not believe there is no god, atheists do not accept the concept as part of the known universe.

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  24. Atheism is the religion of not believing in fairy tales like our parents and there parents have belived in. I do not doubt that God exists but what is god and what gives people the right to say they know who he is or what he is. I recently watched a fictional movie which I recommend to everone it's called, "The Last Man On Earth" It shows how easy it is to break down a religion. If a invention as simple as a light or a lighter can be taken so for granted as they are imagine the what was said about these men when they first invented them. My families religion is catholic and I sometimes question why they are all living rich in the Vatican City while millions of there people are starving to death. And what kind of religion hinds there members that humiliate and practice pedophilia on innocent yound members of their congrant. God will always be god but these so called deciples are as dumb as the religion they believe in.

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  25. This Christian privilege is starting to get on my nerves.

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  26. This guy is brave enough to go on Fox and confront 4 people on his own. Awesome job American Atheists.

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  27. This guy is brave enough to go on Fox and confront 4 people on his own. Awesome job American Atheists.

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  28. This guy is brave enough to go on Fox and confront 4 people on his own. Awesome job American Atheists.

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  29. I love the way Bill tries to associate freedom of religion and expression with Christianity?????

    Get a history book Bill.

    If you have freeom in America it is certainly not because of Christianity but because of seculariam and humanist values.

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  30. <span>I love the way Bill tries to associate freedom of religion and expression with Christianity?????  
     
    Get a history book Bill.  
     
    If you have freedom in America it is certainly not because of Christianity but because of secular and humanist values.</span>

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  31. Nice math genius.
    Plus the blonde hardly counts since she was exeptionally dimwitted and hardly spoke.
    Seemed like fair fight if you total I.Q. points.
    Too bad that preacher got away with his Massive string of lies about the historical proof of Jesus-even down to eye witnesses.
    Atheist should have connected modern non-Judeic religions with mythology as well like a billion and a half Hinus. Greek/Roman/Viking/Egyptian religions are so mind-blocked by cristians that they can only see 'em as mythology, but they will admit Hinduism is a religion. Plus that one is so ancient mythological-looking that it's a great bridge to the old myths/religions.
    He could also point out that the roman emperor converted the romans from zeus to Jesus to help prove myth is religion.

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  32. Careful. I don't know of any mainstream history books that will actually tell you that. Do you think any kids are learning that in any public school in America??

    A MAJOR issuse is that we have to SHOW them those facts. For most people they've never EVER heard them, while they HAVE almost certainly heard the lies that this is a Christian nation and the f. fathers were all christian and jesus invented the american flag when besty ross gave birth to him for the 2nd coming.
    Well... maybe they didn't hear all those things.

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  33. she sais she'd never seen any. He should have made the point that lots and lots of them exist and faux news doesn't care. Instead she and the audience were probably left with the impression that the atheist was making up a ridiculous hypothetical in his weak defense.
    Man I hate these people. They revel in their ignorance.

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  34. I thought that was the biggest 'miss' as well. What a HUGE string of outright lies that he let slide. That's gotta be tough to handle on TV though.

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  35. starting? You must be very young.

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  36. what you wrote was written so poorly that it made no sense. I hope English is not your first language. And if it isn't, you might want to get someone to re-write what you want to post so it isn't near complete gibberish.

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  37. As the public face of American Atheists, he should probably shave the beard and mustache. He looks a little 'arab-y' which to be honest, is REALLY not gonna help make your case. Sorry. It's just a fact.

    Also, by now he's heard all these same attacks about this specfic billboard. He ought to then have pre-memorized perfect comebacks to these attacks. He seems to not really have worked that out.

    Also, his point for this billboard seems fairly misguided. He says it's to draw out all the closet atheists which there are many of. Sadly, this is not a fact that he can in any way prove. Luckily no theist has thrown his key point back in his face, 'cuz it pretty much is a 'faith' claim that he knows this.

    A better point would be to strike at the damage faith causes and christianity in specifically. Even if there are closet atheists (and there must be some, but who knows how many just like how many closet gays are there?). His goal does say why it matters that they 'come out'. He makes it sound like it could just be so he feels better about himself. I KNOW that's not why he does it, but you have to look at how it'll be seen by christians and spun by the religious.

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  38. <span>As the public face of American Atheists, he should probably shave the beard and mustache. He looks a little 'arab-y' which to be honest, is REALLY not gonna help make your case. Sorry. It's just a fact.  
     </span><span>Also, by now he's heard all these same attacks about this specfic billboard. He ought to then have pre-memorized perfect comebacks to these attacks. He seems to not really have worked that out well enough. If you see a lot of Harris, Hitchens, Dawkins, etc... you see the brilliant points they make are the exact same points repeated everywhere they go.</span>
    <span>
    Also, his point for this billboard seems fairly misguided. He says it's to draw out all the 'closet atheists' which he says there are 'many of'. Sadly, this is not a fact that he can in any way 'prove'. Luckily no theist has thrown his key point back in his face, 'cuz it's pretty much just a 'faith claim'. And I hate to say that, but it is. 
     
    A better point would be to say the point of the billboard is to 'strike back' at the damage faith causes civilization and the damage ruinous christians have done specifically-there are tons of great examples to have on hand to list off.He only lists the debated intent of the establishment clause which doesn't move any christians in any way at all.
    </span>

    <span>Even if there are closet atheists (and there must be some, but who knows how many-just like how many closet gays are there?), his goal doesn't say WHY it matters that they 'come out'. He makes it sound like he justs wants them to. And someone could see that as him just wanting to feel better about himself. I KNOW that's not why he does it, but you have to look at how it'll be seen by christians since that 'join the rest of the group' is a HUGE factor in what draws them in and holds them to their warped convictions. </span>

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  39. It sickens me to see that woman in pink go on about how hard it is to raise children of faith these days as if that is her number one duty in life. The way religions treat children is probably what I hate the most about religion.

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  40. I lived in California for a while and I have to say the churches seemed to be more about providing child care than anything else. Most parents we met seemed to use them primarily for this purpose. They tagged along with the religion thing only to maintain the child care access.

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  41. Why is it that Silverman does not speak up when they call atheism a belief and say that it requires evidence? [Agnostic] Atheism is a lack of belief and a refusal to believe without evidence, not a religion. Christians are the ones making the claims here, so the burden of proof is on them.

    I can't believe he let Fox make that point without refuting it, along with the whole 'overwhelming evidence for Jesus' nonsense.

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  42. lol this reminds me of Woody Allen's movie Take the Money and Run. The scene when the father was interviewed about Woody's criminal records and says: I tried beating God into him. He's a no good atheist. Just thought I'd share that.

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  43. I can't stand the amount of discrimination and hypocracy people have towards non-believers... I actually wrote an article about this yesterday. I talk about how Theists are [in ways] more unholy than atheists. 

    http://iantimberlake.wordpress.com/2010/12/05/the-un-society-of-atheism-why-theists-are-more-unholy-than-atheists/

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  44. While I do not expect any history book used in Public schools to actually say that, it does present the inofrmation that proves it to be so.

    The Puritans - yeah a real free and tolerant people who valued other people's freedom! Again, the Virginia Baptists feared the Anglicans, and Jefferson's wall of seperation was introduced to defend freedom. Look at the role of Christianity in Jim Crow laws, Ku Klux Klan, etc, and one soon is able to draw the conclusion that secular and humanitic values were the creators of America's freedom, not Christianity.

    Christianity only ever wants to remove people's freedoms, whether that be womens rights, gay rights, and as it was only 50 years ago, black people's rights! American history clearly shows such to be the case.

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